Show cover of Drive and Convert

Drive and Convert

In this bi-weekly show, hosts Jon MacDonald (The Good) and Ryan Garrow (Logical Position) share their best advice for helping businesses drive high quality traffic to their site, and making sure that traffic converts from a visitor to a buyer. Subscribe if you want to become and expert in customer acquisition and conversion rate optimization.

Tracks

Episode 104: How to Optimize for Both DTC and Wholesale
There is nothing more frustrating to a business than losing out on a sale because their website was optimized for one audience and, in turn, alienated a whole second subset of shoppers. This can be seen in ecommerce brands that have a direct-to-consumer and wholesale operation. However, the two audiences are on completely different customer journeys, making it difficult to create a digital experience that delivers to both.Jon and Ryan delve into the strategic considerations and practical implementation of website elements to effectively cater to both B2B and B2C audiences. From prioritizing primary audiences to creating tailored customer journeys, they explore the challenges and opportunities of maximizing revenue without alienating either group.Listen to the full episode if you want to learn:Why you need to refer to your data How to tailor messaging, design and user experience for both audiencesHow to prioritize audience segmentationHow to leverage menu navigation and landing pages for both audiencesIf you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow.
29:08 4/9/24
Episode 103: How to Find and Utilize the Right Marketing Experts
Jon and Ryan discuss the challenges and importance of wisely selecting and utilizing marketing experts. They cover the pitfalls of deceptive marketing claims and the importance of carefully selecting and evaluating external experts, agencies, or vendors.They also explore the ongoing debate surrounding hiring internal or external marketing experts and teams, providing examples and practical tips for making informed choices that align with your business's needs and resources.Listen to the full episode if you want to learn:How to meticulously select marketing expertsHow to approach the use of AI and automation in marketingWhy you shouldn’t trust marketing collateralHow to find experts that align with your companyHow to make the most of conferences and events If you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow. 
32:27 3/26/24
Episode 102: Why You Shouldn’t Neglect the Post-Purchase Phase - Behind the Click Deep Dive
The digital journey doesn’t end at the checkout.Jon and Ryan discuss the importance of post-purchase optimization and the impact it has on growing an online brand. They share real-life examples and explain how to handle customer feedback, utilizing psychological principles and the significance of the post-purchase phase in driving future orders.Jon also offers a glimpse into his upcoming book, Behind The Click. GET FIRST CHAPTER FREE AT: thegood.com/BTCListen to the full episode if you want to learn:Why the post-purchase is an important part of the customer journeyHow to utilize customer reviews for improvementHow the onboarding process can make or break the digital experienceHow to respond to negative reviewsHow the post-purchase experience impacts future orders If you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow.
27:26 3/12/24
Episode 101: Is Microsoft Ads Worth Your Time?
Jon and Ryan provide valuable insights into the world of Microsoft Ads. The discussion kicks off with an exploration of recent developments at Microsoft, including the company's rebranding of Bing Ads as Microsoft Ads and its strategic investments in AI. They also delve into the potential and opportunities for advertising on Bing, shedding light on the unique advantages of the platform, such as lower competition and potential arbitrage opportunities.Listen to the full episode if you want to learn:Why companies should consider leveraging Microsoft AdsWhat are some key differences between Microsoft Ads and GoogleWhat strategies to use when running campaigns in Microsoft Ads How Microsoft Ads differentiates itself from other platforms Which other platforms to consider outside of Google and Microsoft AdsIf you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow. 
23:57 2/27/24
Episode 100: Our Biggest Lessons From 100 Episodes
Digital experiences are always changing and evolving. So it should come as no surprise that the evolution of AI, automations, and online tools has also shifted some perspectives and progressed certain ways of thinking.In this special episode of Drive and Convert, Jon and Ryan share what lessons they’ve learned in the past four years by revisiting some of the earliest episodes of the show and talking about a few recent ones. Here's a brief look at some of the topics they changed their perspectives on:No to external automation -> Yes to platform automation You shouldn’t benchmark -> Multi-KPI benchmarking can provide great valuePull back on socials -> Platform shops are performing really well  Look at Google Analytics -> Try exploring other toolsTest everything -> Validate your decisionsFind out what else they changed their minds on! If you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow. 
47:24 2/13/24
Episode 99: Announcing Behind the Click
Have you ever wondered what goes through your customer’s mind when they make a certain purchase decision?  Well, you’re not alone.In this episode, Jon and Ryan discuss "Behind the Click", Jon’s upcoming book, which focuses on the psychological principles behind each purchase decision. Jon discusses the inspiration for the book, his approach to writing it, and the overview of the content. He also offers insights into how brands can utilize the information presented in the book to optimize their digital experiences.Listen to the full episode if you want to learn:What ‘Behind the Click’ is aboutWhat heuristics are and why they’re importantHow to ethically use the insights and strategies in the bookWhat phases of the customer journey are included in the bookHow to write books effectively and efficientlyHow to get your copy of ‘Behind the Click’Get your free chapter: http://thegood.com/btc/ If you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow.
20:42 1/30/24
Episode 98: How To Turn Your Google Ads Around
Jon and Ryan explore the challenges brought about by the shift to GA4 and how it has impacted Google Ads. Thankfully, there are some steps that companies can take in order to turn things around. They explore the critical importance of feeding the right data into analytics and the impact of setting appropriate goals to stay ahead of the competition. Listen to the full episode if you want to learn:What challenges companies are experiencing with Google AdsHow to leverage Google Ads PixelWhy companies need to review and adjust their goals How to optimize product feedsWhy you need to test and measure any changesIf you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow.
20:38 1/16/24
Episode 97: You've Got Data! Now What?
Many companies conduct amazing research to understand their customers, but more often than not, this research gets lost and isn’t maximized to its full potential. Quantitative and qualitative data from customer survey results, user testing recordings, and interview transcripts can all lead to important learnings for your organization, so how can you make sure to leverage it? In this Drive and Convert episode, Jon and Ryan discuss actionable steps that you can take to help your future self and your team use the data you collect.Listen to the full episode if you want to learn:How to organize the data you’ve collected How to identify patterns and insights from dataHow to map data observations to areas of your business Which areas you can improve based on dataIf you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow.
19:23 1/2/24
Episode 96: Going from WTF to YAY with GA4
Ecommerce businesses are navigating the biggest transition of this year with Google Analytics 4 (GA4). In this D&C episode, Jon and Ryan acknowledge some initial challenges with the platform's interface and data comparisons, but they remain optimistic about its potential. They recommend exploring complementary tools and focusing on trend identification to unlock GA4's full potential. Ultimately, embracing GA4's learning curve and exploring alternatives can empower ecommerce businesses to thrive in the evolving data landscape.Listen to the full episode if you want to learn:The biggest roadblocks businesses face when switching to GA4Why you still need GA4 for your website What data you can get from GA4 that wasn’t available in UAHow to overcome the hurdles of Year-Over-Year analysisWhat alternative tools can support or replace GA4If you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow.
29:37 12/19/23
Episode 95: How to Leverage AI in UX Optimization
AI is a pretty buzzy term, and it can mean different things to different people. In this episode, Jon and Ryan engage in a lively discussion about the use of AI, with a specific focus on its application in UX and optimization. They start by differentiating actual AI tools from AI enabled applications. Then, they delve into the practical applications and potential benefits of ChatGPT, touching on its affordability, effectiveness in idea generation, and visual design capabilities.  Listen to the full episode if you want to learn:What you can accomplish with a free version of ChatGPTHow to write specific prompts for brainstorming and ideationHow to use ChatGPT to write codes and create prototypes for your website Why AI is important for rewriting and condensing data, information and website copyHow to apply AI in visual design and user researchCheck out Tldraw in action! If you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow.
32:19 12/5/23
Episode 94: The Rise of Video in 2024
In this episode of Drive & Convert, Jon and Ryan delve into the rise of video as a powerful tool for digital marketing. They discuss the impact of platforms like TikTok, the changing landscape of video monetization, Apple's influence on tracking and privacy, the growth of Connected TV, and the importance of creative content in video marketing.Sharing insights and experiences from their own journey in the ecommerce space, Jon and Ryan explore how brands can leverage video to drive conversions and growth.Listen to the full episode if you want to learn:What type of video content you can leverage in digital marketing How to track ROI for YouTube spend How video is being utilized on different platforms  What challenges small brands encounter in video marketing Why it’s crucial to have quality and creative content If you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow.
32:15 11/21/23
Episode 93: Why November is the Most Underrated Time for a Website Audit
Ecommerce managers are juggling a million things by the time Q4 rolls around. They’re busy preparing holiday campaigns and gearing up for the coming year. However, optimization should still be top of mind during Q4, and the perfect way to ensure this happens is through a website audit. This week, Jon and Ryan explore eight benefits that a November audit can provide your business. You can level up against the competition by continuing their optimization work through the end of the year – when other brands are at a standstill.Listen to the full episode if you want to learn:Why November audits are often misunderstoodHow to fit in a November audit during the holiday rushThe benefits of conducting a November audit Why its an especially good year for a Q4 website audit If you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow.
29:18 11/7/23
Episode 92: What You Need to Know About SEO Right Now
SEO takes time, money, and energy. There is no shortcut to achieving increased rankings on a search results page over a short period of time. So, whether you’re just starting out or you’ve been in the business awhile, you need to have a strategy for SEO. In today’s episode, Jon and Ryan share that while there are no hacks, there are proven ways to build the right strategy that will get you in front of the right audience. Listen to the full episode if you want to learn:Why there is no “hacking” SEO Why website optimization is crucial to SEO What role quality content has for SEO Why backlinks are still valuable How long it takes to see results from SEOIf you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow.
31:45 10/24/23
Episode 91: Turning One-Time Buyers into Loyal Subscribers
People have a lot of options when it comes to subscriptions. And now more than ever, people are conscious of where and what they spend their money on.  In this episode, Jon and Ryan discuss how to acquire and retain subscribers with proven strategies including personalization, various types of subscriptions, and tactics for increasing your number of subscribers. They also cover how to look at things from a consumer perspective in order to fully understand what needs companies can address with their subscription services.  Listen to the full episode if you want to learn:The different types of subscription services Why personalization is important Why brands need to identify where customers churnSeven strategies to increase subscriptions If you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow.
37:55 10/10/23
Episode 90: What is a Good ROAS (Return on Ad Spend)?
What is a good return on ad spend?Just like the question posed in our last episode, there is no simple answer to this. In this week’s episode, Jon and Ryan delve into the importance of tailoring your ROAS goals to your unique brand. They also touch on the aggressiveness of marketing strategy, customer lifetime value, and the benefits of aiming for a lower break-even ROAS. Listen to the full episode if you want to learn:How brands can optimize their ROAS goalsWhy brands should consider influencer marketing and dark postingWhy there is no one-size-fits-all approach to ROASHow analytics can help in determining ROAS If you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow.
31:11 9/26/23
Episode 89: What is a Good Conversion Rate?
So, what is a good conversion rate? Is there a magic number you should be aiming for or a percentage that, when you reach it, means you’ve hit the big time and you can sit back and relax?In this week’s episode, Jon and Ryan discuss why there is no one-size-fits-all answer to this question. They delve into the definition of conversion rate and the countless variables that affect it. In the end, their advice is this: a good conversion rate is one that is constantly improving. Listen to the full episode if you want to learn:What variables affect conversion ratesWhat conversion rate actually meansHow to measure conversion ratesWhat are the challenges in measuring conversion ratesWhy you shouldn’t measure yourself against ecommerce benchmarks If you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow.
27:08 9/12/23
Episode 88: The Future of Attribution and AI
What is the future of digital marketing and online experience?Jon and Ryan unpack the valuable insights gained from recent events with Google and Logical Position to try and answer this question. They discuss the challenges faced by smaller businesses in the ever-changing landscape of attribution models and the importance of thinking outside the box when it comes to driving brand growth. From exploring alternative methods of customer acquisition to diving into the world of AI and attribution, this is everything you missed at the Google and Logical Position events! Listen to the full episode if you want to learn:How GA4 will impact SMBs and larger brandsWhy it's important to constantly analyze data What the future of attribution and AI looks likeWhat additional strategies and resources to consider for the holidaysIf you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow.
30:05 8/29/23
Episode 87: Should I drive traffic to a landing page or PDP?
Sending everyone to a Product Detail Page (PDP) without context or information about the brand can be counterproductive in building trust. Landing pages, however, allow for more curated information and more consistent and relevant messaging during the customer journey. This is exactly what Jon and Ryan explore in this week’s Drive and Convert episode. They also cover how the lack of educational information on a PDP could make it difficult to convince customers to make a purchase.  Listen to the full episode if you want to learn:Why landing pages are crucial for building trust and educating customers Why alignment between ad messaging and landing pages is importantHow landing pages should be optimized for Google Shopping trafficHow context and personalization can improve landing pages and PDPsHow to create and optimize landing pages If you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow.
23:47 8/15/23
Episode 86: Where's the Traffic?
From struggling marketplaces to recent stock turmoil, Jon and Ryan explore the factors impacting traffic and sales in the ecommerce industry. They take a deep dive into how competition, economic factors, and changing consumer behavior are reshaping the e-commerce landscape. In this week’s episode, they discuss powerful strategies for driving traffic and sales and how brands can leverage Google's algorithms to their advantage.  Listen to the full episode if you want to learn:How the decrease in search volume on Google affect transaction and sales volumeWhat methods Amazon uses to drive traffic beyond search trafficHow brands can leverage Google's algorithm to increase product discoveryWhy testing and experimentation are crucial for staying ahead of the competitionIf you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow.
26:49 8/2/23
Episode 85: Nine Strategies to Increase Average Order Value
It can be difficult to convince new customers to purchase from your site the first time they visit. Instead of driving traffic and new visitors to your site, why don’t you focus on the customers you already have?This week, Jon and Ryan share how you can leverage nine proven strategies to help you increase average order value. By improving the average order value of your website, you can grow your business without having to invest heavily in additional marketing and advertising. Listen to the full episode if you want to learn:How to find out your customer’s needs Nine proven tactics to increase AOV (with examples)Why social proof is such a powerful toolHow to execute limited offers properlyWhy it’s important to remember post-purchase offersIf you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow.
35:54 7/18/23
Episode 84: Holiday Analysis and Adjustments
Each holiday season is different, so how do you prepare for one? As a business, it’s important to use data-driven strategies and think creatively when planning for your holiday campaign. In this week’s episode, Jon and Ryan share a few ideas on how to think about the holidays and what you need to do to stand out from the competition.  Listen to the full episode if you want to learn:Why each holiday season is differentHow to define the holiday seasonHow to use data to determine holiday periodsHow to prepare for the holiday seasonWhen to start advertising for the holidaysIf you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow.
29:32 7/10/23
Episode 83: Winning Tests and What the Learnings Can Teach You
Sharing winning tests isn’t just a way to celebrate success with previous clients. The patterns and insights from winning tests can offer a lot of ideas for other brands looking to improve their conversion rates and boost sales. In particular, Jon and Ryan talk about three areas of a site that tests work really well in: category pages, social proof, and website copy.  Listen to the full episode if you want to learn:How personalization can improve category pages Why you need clear and specific labels on your navigation How to leverage different types of social proof How small changes in copy can lead to big results If you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow.
32:53 6/20/23
Episode 82: 5 Points to Make Email Your Most Successful Marketing Channel
So much energy is focused on driving traffic to a site via different platforms, but Jon and Ryan share why email should be the most profitable traffic acquisition channel. In this episode, they discuss how you can set up your account and create automatic email flows. Ryan puts emphasis on not buying your email list. They also dive into examples of automatic email flows, such as a welcome series or an abandoned cart email, before sharing 5 points to help you successfully scale your email marketing campaign.  Listen to the full episode if you want to learn:How to utilize free email systems like Klaviyo and MailchimpWhy you need to keep growing your email list Why you need to segment your customers and personalize their experienceHow to leverage your email data for your other marketing channelsWhy it’s important to test your email marketing campaignIf you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow.
23:37 6/6/23
Episode 81: 9 Key Ecommerce Metrics You Should Be Tracking
In this episode of Drive & Convert, Jon and Ryan share important metrics for businesses to monitor including customer acquisition cost, customer lifetime value, and conversion rates. They stress the importance of understanding which metrics will impact the bottom line and align with the company's strategic goals.They also delve into the importance of tracking your raw data, channel mix metrics, and evaluating subscription and consumable products.  Listen to the full episode if you want to learn:How to determine and evaluate significant ecommerce metricsWhy you should focus on long-lasting customer relationshipsWhat value can you get from post-purchase surveysWhat is the “first-touch” metricHow to improve your own ecommerce metricsIf you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow.
32:50 5/23/23
Episode 80: Managing Attribution Model Changes
In this podcast episode, Jon and Ryan discuss Google's recent announcement about sunsetting certain attribution types in Analytics. They both emphasize the need for businesses to get creative and find new strategies to compete with larger brands. Jon suggests that small brands have an advantage in being more willing to take risks and test different approaches. For small brands, they suggest exploring social media, influencer marketing, affiliate partnerships, and top-of-funnel strategies to drive awareness and engagement. They conclude that the evolving digital landscape requires businesses to adapt and find new ways to stand out in the competitive e-commerce space.Listen to the full episode if you want to learn:What attribution models are being removed from GoogleWhy Google is sunsetting four of its attribution modelsHow these attribution changes could affect transparency and Google algorithmsWhat alternative options do big and small brands have If you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow.
24:38 5/9/23
Episode 79: Ensuring Your Website Navigation Converts
What’s the best type of navigation to use for your website? Jon and Ryan reveal that there is no one-size fits all approach to this question. However, customer research and experimentation can help determine the most effective navigation style. Jon offers 10-pointers for website owners to test or steal, which are based on what has worked well for other brands. They stress the importance of designing navigation based on what customers want, not what the brand wants. Listen to the full episode if you want to learn:1. Why website navigation is crucial to a website’s functionality2. The different types of website navigation3. How to improve your website navigation 4. 10 stealable tips for website navigationIf you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow.For more information, read the full article at: https://thegood.com/insights/website-navigation/ 
26:49 4/25/23
Episode 78: Exiting an Online Business
A lot of emotions are involved in exiting a business, and Ryan emphasizes the importance of legal advice and research along the way. In this episode, Jon and Ryan also talk about failing and growing throughout the experience and seeing everything as a learning experience. Every business exit is a little different, so there is no defined timeline for going through the process. Ryan advises that you should do it when it feels right, and the numbers will work themselves out. Listen to the full episode if you want to learn:Why it's important not to burn bridges and end things on a positive note How relationships with employees change Why doing more research is important Why you should invest in a good legal team What to look forward to after exiting an ecommerce business If you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow.
20:39 4/11/23
Episode 77 : Optimizing Conversions with Low Traffic (Live)
Conversion rate optimization is important for any ecommerce brand, but it’s markedly more difficult for brands with lower traffic. However, there are still ways how you can increase website conversions with low traffic.In this week’s episode, Jon and Ryan highlight the significance of leaning into rapid testing in the absence of data to validate statistical significance. They also discuss other validation tactics, such as surveys, user testing, heatmaps, and many more.  Listen to the full episode if you want to learn:How to use the confidence/tolerance relationship to your advantageThe benefits of rapid testingValidation tactics beyond testingHow social listening and session recordings workWhy eye tracking is simple yet effective If you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow.
17:17 3/28/23
Episode 76: Conversion Tracking in Performance Max
Last year, Google moved people over from Smart Shopping to Performance Max, and they said Performance Max would be the “one campaign to rule them all.” The struggle now, especially for smaller advertisers, is not having enough data points. And the more data you give an algorithm, generally, the better it’s going to be able to accomplish your goal.In this episode, Jon and Ryan discuss what conversion tracking looks like in this new world of Performance Max and how you could help your system and ads perform better once you get some of the right data points.Listen to the full episode if you want to learn:What conversion tracking looks like on PMaxHow the PMax algorithm works What eCommerce advertisers should focus on trackingWhy Google Analytics is still the best source of data Why you need to test and optimize your feedIf you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow.
18:11 3/14/23
Episode 75: Why Industry Benchmarks Are Bullshit
Industry benchmarks are an obvious starting point for anyone looking to set goals. Unfortunately, comparing your conversion rate to the rates of other companies (or the industry as a whole) is meaningless.Unlike studying your competitors, studying your customers is directly applicable. The better you can serve their needs and create better shopping experiences, the higher your conversion rate will climb. In this episode, Jon and Ryan talk about alternatives such as goal-setting, iterative learning and experimentation.Listen to the full episode if you want to learn:Why industry benchmarks should not be your starting point for setting goalsHow you should approach measuring conversion ratesWhat the flaws of self-reporting among competitors isWhat factors affect conversion rateHow you can work on continuously improving your conversion rateIf you have questions, ideas, or feedback to share, connect with us on LinkedIn. We're Jon MacDonald and Ryan Garrow.
27:00 2/28/23