Market Leaders Podcast

Join Hannah Smith in this episode of The Market Leaders Podcast as she welcomes Bree Metherall, Chief Marketing & Business Development Officer at Stoel Rives, for a conversation on the evolving CMBDO role and what true integration between marketing and business development really looks like. Bree shares why integration is more than an organizational structure. It's a leadership philosophy. Together, Hannah and Bree explore how curiosity, collaboration, and a shared understanding of business objectives create stronger teams, better client outcomes, and more strategic decision-making across the firm. Tune in to discover why the future of the CMBDO role depends less on organizational charts and more on creating a culture where collaboration, strategic thinking, and commercial understanding drive firm growth.

7/15/26 • 24:19

Join Hannah Smith in this episode of the Market Leaders Podcast as she welcomes Jessica Grayson, Chief Growth Officer at Stradley Ronon, for a discussion on the evolving role of lateral hiring in law firm growth. Jessica shares why successful lateral acquisitions begin long before a partner joins the firm and how firms can create a stronger foundation for long-term success. She discusses the importance of strategic planning, candidate experience, and setting clear expectations throughout the recruiting and integration process. The conversation also explores the role of culture, collaboration, and accountability in helping laterals thrive. Hannah and Jessica examine what firms should be looking for beyond a portable book of business and how thoughtful integration can unlock greater value for both the lateral and the firm. Tune in to learn how leading firms are approaching lateral growth, creating meaningful connections, and building environments where new partners can succeed.

6/18/26 • 23:26

In this special episode of the Market Leaders Podcast, Jackie Kappas interviews David Ackert—author of The Short List and co-founder and CEO of PipelinePlus—for an honest conversation about authenticity, connection, and the real work behind business development. David shares why The Short List resonates so widely and explains how focusing on the people who matter most can transform both career growth and personal fulfillment. Jackie and David dig into imposter syndrome, rejection, and the pressure professionals feel to perform, and why leaning into genuine, meaningful relationships is the antidote. The episode also opens a window into David’s personal world: the influence of his wife and business partner, Rebecca; his journey as a former actor and how it shaped his resilience; and the profound impact of his decade-long role as a Big Brother mentor. The conversation ultimately reinforces a simple truth: when we lead with purpose, authenticity, and human connection, we build careers and communities that truly matter.

11/13/25 • 33:27

In this episode of the Market Leaders Podcast, host David Ackert sits down with Kate Stoddard, Chief Marketing Officer at Kelley Drye, to explore the pervasive issue of siloing within law firms and how to overcome it. Drawing on her 15 years of experience at Kelley Drye, Kate shares insights into the firm's business development strategy and the innovative approaches they've taken to foster cohesion and enhance client service.  Kate delves into the challenges posed by siloing, describing law firms as "archipelagos"—a collection of individual practices operating independently rather than as a cohesive unit. She discusses the importance of collaboration, training, and leadership in breaking down these silos, providing practical examples from Kelley Drye's marketing department and firm-wide initiatives.  Listeners will gain valuable perspectives on transforming law firm culture and enhancing client relationships through teamwork and collaboration. Kate offers advice for firms struggling with cohesion, emphasizing the need for leadership commitment, clear expectations, and continuous communication. 

9/25/24 • 23:29

In this episode of the Market Leaders Podcast, host David Ackert interviews Sian Story, General Counsel at Vendavo, about her unique career journey. Sian shares how she started in tax law in the UK and eventually moved to Silicon Valley, where she worked at Osborne Clarke advising U.S. companies on European law. Unlike most in-house counsel, she took on a dual role that combined legal work with business development, giving her valuable experience in building client relationships and understanding the business development process from both sides of the table.  Sian discusses the importance of personalized client relationship-building for successful business development in the legal industry. Rather than relying on generic networking events or impersonal email blasts, she highlights how creating meaningful one-on-one connections through tailored events, coffee meetings, and informal conversations can foster trust with clients. These bespoke approaches allow lawyers to understand and solve specific client pain points, which ultimately leads to stronger, long-term relationships.  Throughout the conversation, Sian touches on the evolving role of sales in legal practice and the increasing impact of AI on the industry. She argues that law firms must embrace the sales process and train junior lawyers early in their careers to develop lasting client networks. As AI and alternative legal service providers continue to change the landscape, Sian emphasizes that building authentic, trusted relationships will remain a key differentiator for lawyers in the future. 

9/18/24 • 34:33

In this episode of the Market Leaders Podcast, host David Ackert interviews Guest Chris Pullen, Head of Business Development at Kennedys. Chris shares his extensive experience spanning over thirty years in law, including a significant period at Ernst & Young. They discuss the perceived encroachment of the big four accounting firms into the legal market and explore why this hasn't materialized as expected.   Chris highlights the advantages the big four hold, such as their global scale and strong sales culture, and contrasts them with the inherent strengths of traditional law firms, including depth in major jurisdictions and the ability to handle significant litigation. They explore deeply the cultural differences between the two types of firms, particularly in client relationship management and the focus on margins.  Chris also provides valuable lessons that law firms can learn from the big four, emphasizing the importance of systematic processes and future-focused strategies. Tune in for an insightful discussion on the evolving dynamics between law firms and the big four. 

8/22/24 • 28:02

In this episode of the Market Leaders Podcast, host David Ackert and guest Mira Dewji, Chief Inclusion and Diversity Officer at Seyfarth, have an insightful discussion about Mira’s journey from being an associate lawyer to becoming a leader in diversity and inclusion (DEI). Together, they explore the importance of moving beyond optics-driven DEI initiatives toward creating genuine, inclusive workplace cultures.  Mira and David delve into the significance of fostering environments where individuals can bring their whole selves to work, the impact of stakeholder-driven DEI efforts, and the challenges of balancing short-term and long-term DEI strategies. Mira emphasizes that effective DEI work requires contributions from everyone in the organization, not just those from underrepresented groups. This includes practical measures like performance evaluation criteria, job descriptions, and recognition of diversity efforts.  She also discusses the concept of the "diversity tax". She explores ways to mitigate it, such as clear performance evaluation questions, term limits for committee roles, and creditable hours for DEI contributions. Mira highlights the need for inclusive leadership, which involves being open to different perspectives, having uncomfortable conversations, and balancing both the moral and business cases for DEI.  The episode concludes with Mira offering advice to law firm leaders on addressing DEI challenges, particularly for mid-sized firms without client mandates. She encourages moving away from simplistic narratives and developing practical skills to foster long-term inclusion and diversity in the workplace. 

7/19/24 • 37:30

In this episode of the Market Leader’s Podcast, host David Ackert engages in an insightful conversation with Courtney Beauzile, the head of Marketing, business development, and communications at Robins Kaplan. Courtney shares her journey from sales to legal marketing, detailing her extensive experience in team building. At Robins Kaplan, she has undertaken a comprehensive listening tour to align her team with the firm’s strategic goals, focusing on strengths, growth areas, and motivation.    Courtney outlines her four-pillar structure for a high-performing department: digital marketing, communications, business development, and operations. She emphasizes the importance of operations in integrating technology and data to drive strategic decisions. The discussion highlights the evolving needs in legal marketing, stressing the significance of data literacy and technological integration.    Courtney also shares innovative strategies for filling skill gaps, including hiring temporary staff to assess fit before making permanent offers. She underscores the value of professional development, advocating for regular training and management development programs to prepare team members for leadership roles.  Listeners will gain valuable insights into effective team building, the importance of continuous professional development, and innovative staffing solutions. Courtney’s practical advice and forward-thinking approach provide a blueprint for leaders looking to enhance their teams' capabilities and performance. 

6/17/24 • 16:56

Join host David Ackert as he explores business development in the digital age with guest Adrian Lürssen. Adrian is Co-Founder and VP Strategic Development at JD Supra, a leading online publishing and targeted content distributor, empowering professionals to showcase their expertise, gain media attention, and establish authority in their respective fields.  In this episode, David and Adrian explore key aspects of business development in today's digital landscape. Starting with David’s five-stage framework for relationship building, straight from his upcoming book, "The Short List."  Adrian shares his ideas on thought leadership, content creation, distribution, and promotion, highlighting the importance of crafting a unique voice that resonates with your target audience and builds trust.   Then, they discuss the role of data-driven marketing in making informed strategic decisions. Adrian will share insights on leveraging large datasets to gain a competitive edge and convert prospects into loyal clients.  If you're ready to advance your business development efforts, join us for this insightful conversation.

4/30/24 • 30:38

Join David Ackert in this episode of the Market Leader’s Podcast as he welcomes special guests Robin D. Davidson, Head of Business Development and Communications at Boies Schiller, and Matt Plavnick, Director of Client Development at Wheeler Trigg O'Donnell. They engage in a conversation centered around the concept of "constructive pushback" in legal business development and the challenges it presents. David explores Robin and Matt's experiences with past leaders and how their leadership styles have shaped their approach to navigating constructive pushback in the legal industry. They discuss the critical components essential to authentic leadership, emphasizing the importance of framing pushback as a collaborative conversation to improve outcomes rather than opposing ideas. Moreover, they delve into the increasingly blurred lines between personal and work lives and the significance of forging genuine human connections in a digitized economy. The conversation also covers strategies for training and developing junior professionals to handle such interactions effectively, including encouraging observation, modeling, and feedback. Tune in to learn about the power of saying “No” to create space for “Yes” in client interactions, the why behind actions, and the consistent delivery of excellent service. Discover how to empower teams and employees through authentic leadership and gracefully navigate the complexities of legal business development. Listen, Subscribe, Like, & Comment below to gain valuable insights into navigating constructive pushback in legal business development and fostering a culture of collaboration and creativity from our PipelinePlus community.

4/8/24 • 43:25

In this episode of The Market Leaders Podcast, host David Ackert sits down with John Byrne, Chief Marketing Officer at Gould Ratner and incoming President-elect of LMA. They explore upcoming themes and objectives for the Legal Marketing Association as they approach their fortieth anniversary in 2025.  Highlights include:  Reflections on the evolution of the legal marketing profession and the challenges and opportunities posed by generational differences in the workplace. Recognition of the growing value brought by legal marketers and the importance of collective knowledge-sharing within the profession. Emphasis on the need for legal marketers to adapt to changing dynamics and embrace new perspectives to continue driving growth and innovation in the industry.  John also touches upon:  The evolving roles of Chief Marketing Officers, with many transitioning to Chief Strategy roles. Increased recognition of marketing talents, resulting in more marketers sitting at decision-making tables. A shift towards results-driven marketing and ROI-driven strategies. The impact of technological advancements on modernizing marketing practices. Challenges and opportunities in education and networking, particularly due to the pandemic's shift to remote interactions. Advice for professionals looking to get involved in LMA, encouraging proactive engagement and leveraging networking opportunities within the legal marketing community.  Tune in for these insights and more from John Byrne on this episode of The Market Leaders Podcast. 

3/15/24 • 41:37

In this episode of The Market Leaders Podcast, host David Ackert chats with Kevin Iredell, the new 2024 Legal Marketing Association President and Chief Marketing and Business Development Officer at Lowenstein Sandler. They delve into Kevin's game plan as LMA President, his sharp business approach at his firm, and strategies for post-pandemic growth. Highlights include: Kevin's LMA presidency priorities: profitability, member experience, and expanded education.Navigating leadership in a post-pandemic world.LMA National 2024 Keynote speaker, Jamie Lawless from Husch-Blackwell Why having business minds in law firm leadership matters.Embracing iterative progress over perfection.The power of collaborative leadership and streamlining operations. Tune in for these highlights and more from our conversation with Kevin Iredell.

2/9/24 • 18:01

On this episode of The Market Leaders Podcast, join host David Ackert and special guest Roy Sexton, Director of Marketing at Clark Hill Law, for a conversation that looks back at the industry trends that defined 2023, Roy’s tenure as the President of the Legal Marketing Association, and where the legal marketing industry is heading in 2024 and beyond.   Tune in to hear about:  -       Building community and collaboration in and after the pandemic -       Reflections on organizational impact and personal growth -       Exploring unique expression and authenticity in relationships -       Managing challenges and building unity in a diverse community -       The importance of data and accountability in organizational management -       The art of risk taking in leadership -       And more

1/19/24 • 42:14

In this episode of the Market Leader’s Podcast, Justin Portaz, Chief Marketing and Business Development Officer at Jenner & Block LLP discusses authentic leadership and its influence on firm culture. Tune in to hear about: -      The impact of authentic leadership style -      Why genuine human connections are becoming increasingly important in an ever-accelerating digitized economy -      The increasingly blurred lines between personal lives and work lives -      The impact and influence generated through empowering one’s team, employees, and more

12/5/23 • 24:58

In this episode of the Market Leaders Podcast, David Ackert welcomes special guest Diane Paoletta, Director of Marketing at Phillips Nizer. Diane has had a dynamic career, spearheading marketing and business development efforts at multiple professional services firms – from accounting to consulting to legal. David and Diane explore the similarities and differences in applying business development principles and tactics at professional services firms across different industries, particularly examining the dynamic between law and accounting.   David and Diane engage in an insightful discussion, including:  Diane’s personal account of the transition from accounting to legal Strategic similarities between the two industries and common tactics that Diane has successfully implemented at each Industry/firm perspectives on the practice of business development, as well as the tracking and reporting on progress Tips to successfully leveraging personal networks and the shared networks of those around you Advice for marketers looking at transitioning from one industry to another And more     

11/15/23 • 24:17

In this episode of the Market Leader’s Podcast, David Ackert welcomes Samantha McKenna, founder of #samsales, for an insightful conversation centered around creating, leveraging, and maintaining relationships in a hyper-personalized way – by showing them that you truly know them.  Samantha and David discuss a wide range of topics around this centralized issue, including:   The hyper personalized approach AKA “Show Me You Know Me” (#SMYKM) Email frameworks around how to approach the buyer as a human Specific knowledge and awareness of the buyer as a member of an industry, executive decision maker, and most importantly - as a real personHow to stay top of mind in an ever- accelerating age of information Intelligently leveraging LinkedIn to remain connected to and relevant to your buyers And so many more insights and methods to assist in optimizing business development efforts  

10/27/23 • 23:46

In this episode of the Market Leader’s Podcast, join David Ackert and special guest Roberto Pont, Chief Strategy and Operations Officer at McInnes Cooper, as they engage in an enlightening conversation regarding innovation within law firms, specifically the use of technology and financial forecasting models, the rise of AI, and how to overcome the challenges inherent to law firms – and in working with lawyers – that can emerge throughout the implementation of such initiatives.  David and Roberto cover a vast array of topics, including:  Making meaningful change Perfect is the enemy of the good Shifting the lawyer mindset Client partnerships How to use and not use AI and much more.

10/5/23 • 17:52

In this episode of the Market Leader’s Podcast, join David Ackert and special guest Roberto Pont, Chief Strategy and Operations Officer at McInnes Cooper, as they engage in an enlightening conversation regarding innovation within law firms, specifically the use of technology and financial forecasting models, the rise of AI, and how to overcome the challenges inherent to law firms – and in working with lawyers – that can emerge throughout the implementation of such initiatives.  David and Roberto cover a vast array of topics, including:  Making meaningful change Perfect is the enemy of the good Shifting the lawyer mindset Client partnerships How to use and not use AI and much more.

10/5/23 • 17:52

In this episode of the Market Leader’s Podcast, join host David Ackert as he sits down with Koree Khongphand-Buckman, Chief Marketing and Business Development Officer at Foley & Lardner LLP, to explore the world of data-driven marketing and business development in the legal industry. Together, they dive into the challenges law firms face when implementing a data-driven approach and how Foley & Lardner is effectively utilizing data to target key sectors, share best practices, and enhance the overall client experience. Throughout the episode, Koree emphasizes the importance of fostering collaboration between departments and underscores the need for viewing data as a valuable firm-wide asset, empowering more informed strategic decision-making. Uncover the hurdles law firms encounter, including encouraging lawyers to actively contribute data and share contacts, while transitioning marketing from an administrative function to a strategic one. Additionally, gain insight into the advantages of adopting a centralized data system and the significance of leveraging the right technologies for success. Whether you're a legal professional or interested in data-driven strategies for business development and client engagement, this interview provides valuable insights you won't want to miss. Tune in now and discover how data can revolutionize the legal industry.

8/3/23 • 29:07

In this episode of the Market Leader’s Podcast, David Ackert, with guest Vivian Coco, Head of Marketing, Communications, and Client Relations at Licks Attorneys of Rio de Janeiro, Brazil, discuss a variety of factors associated with satisfying DEI requirements across cultures, countries, and regions.   Tune in to hear more about: DEI as a concept and its evolution across varied regionsParticular challenges of DEI initiatives associated with the Brazilian marketHow international firms address DEIVivian’s exposure to DEI, the ensuing impact on her perspective and careerCriticisms commonly faced by law firms for DEI/social justice initiatives and prioritization (or lack thereof), and the fairness of those criticismsThe future of DEI in Legal and more

7/5/23 • 35:25

In this podcast episode, David Ackert interviews Mark Hunter, Principal at Glen Maple Group, about the importance of client experience in professional services firms, particularly in the legal industry. Mark shares his background in CRM solutions and his current work with Glen Maple Group, which provides marketing and communication services to professional services firms on a fractional basis. They discuss how client expectations have changed and why firms need to pay more attention to client experience. Mark emphasizes the need for firms to align with clients' values, preferences, and work styles to create a positive and lasting client experience. They also talk about the practical aspects of implementing client experience initiatives, such as consistent communication, transparency, and acknowledging and acting on client feedback. Mark highlights the significance of understanding the audience and tailoring the client experience accordingly. The conversation concludes with a discussion on the importance of honesty, transparency, and accountability in maintaining strong client relationships.

6/21/23 • 23:18

In this episode, join David Ackert as he engages in a captivating conversation with Mitchell Reno, Principal Director of Client Experience at Rehmann, shedding light on the ever-evolving landscape of Client Experience in professional services firms. With over two decades of Sales, Marketing, and CX expertise at Rehmann, one of the top professional advisory firms in the US, Mitch shares invaluable insights into this critical domain. The episode kicks off by unraveling the true essence of Client Experience, exploring its definition and distinguishing it from client service. Mitch delves deep into the intricacies of the client journey, dissecting it into a 5 segment cycle and emphasizing the role of engineering a signature experience that can be consistently replicated to drive firm differentiation. Discover the transformative power of active listening and feedback gathering as David and Mitch discuss their significance in optimizing the client experience over time. Learn how leveraging these insights can lead to continuous re-engineering, resulting in remarkable outcomes for professional service firms. Tune in to this episode to gain exclusive access to Mitch's wealth of knowledge, where he shares: Insider perspectives on Client Experience (CX) in professional services firmsA comparative analysis of client experience vs. client serviceIn-depth exploration of the complete client journey through a 5 segment cycleThe paramount importance of active listening and feedback utilization to continually enhance and re-engineer the client experience, yielding optimal outcomes

6/7/23 • 29:42

In this episode of the Market Leaders Podcast, David Ackert, with guest Lisa Vicine, Chief Marketing Officer at Arnall, Golden, Gregory LLP, unpack the keys to recruiting, developing and retaining an effective marketing and business development team. Tune in to hear about: How Lisa rebuilt the foundation of her marketing and business development department at AGGThe ways she protects, engages, and empowers her department to enable their growth.How she worked to align the services and the talent at her firm with where their attorneys need the most support, and how this realignment has impacted the lawyers’ books of business at AGG.

5/24/23 • 29:38

A rising tide raises all boats. In this episode of the Market Leaders Podcast, David Ackert, with guests Morgan Lewis' Chief Business Development Officer Amanda Bruno and Director of Business Development Coaching and Training Debra Hare, unpack how this sentiment is at the core of the firm’s BD ethos. They explore how the firm's collaborative culture is a key contributor to its success in preparing rising partners, retaining laterals, providing business development coaching and training, delivering premium client service, and more. Tune in to hear about: How Morgan Lewis sets new partners up for successHow contribution is a core pillar of the culture at Morgan LewisMorgan Lewis’ Rising Partner ProgramThe importance of accountability and assistance to move the business plan alongFinding synergies and mining collaboration opportunities from business plans

4/17/23 • 31:05

In this episode, David Ackert chats with Scott Love, President of The Attorney Search Group and a leading authority in legal recruiting, about three critical firm growth strategies: encouraging lawyers to expand their books of business through their referral network, through prospecting, and through lateral recruiting. Scott shares his expertise on how firms can overcome impediments to progress by building trust with clients, making people feel safe, prioritizing sincerity and authenticity, ensuring their efforts are regular and consistent, and always keeping the best interests of their clients top of mind. David and Scott also discuss the inherently challenging social experience of integrating new team members, and the importance of overcoming our natural tendencies towards distrust. Tune in to hear Scott share his perspective on: The three key ways firms can growThe importance of referrals in establishing safety and trust Direct vs. inbound prospectingStriking a balance between being business minded and relationship minded How firms can leverage lateral recruiting effectivelyThe necessity of a strong integration process, and how it can become a key selling point for a law firm

3/30/23 • 22:22

Join David Ackert in this episode of the Market Leaders podcast as he speaks with Mike Mellor, the Chief Marketing and Business Development Officer at Pryor Cashman LLP. Mike's extensive experience in professional services marketing informs his insights on the importance of industry-focused go-to-market strategies, client-centric language, and tactical execution involving market analysis and creative alliances. Discover how Mike's firm leverages data to plan engaging events and webinars, earns partners' trust through data-driven decision-making, and how Mike's obsession with data trends fuels real-time marketing improvements. Tune in to hear Mike share his thoughts on: The historical “practice group” structure and why it’s problematicHow a go-to-market (GTM) strategy can benefit both the attorneys and the clientsHow to tactically execute a GTMAnalyzing for ROI and monitoring KPIsTips for avoiding analysis paralysis

3/15/23 • 14:50

In times of uncertainty, the value of wisdom can't be overstated. In this special retrospective episode of the Market Leaders podcast, we reflect on the valuable insights shared by our recent guests that are particularly relevant for navigating the current market and economic challenges that may lie ahead. Join us as we explore Steve Martini and Larry Braun's perspectives on building relationships, Colin Keefe's essential guidance on rate structuring, and Eva Wisnik's recruitment ideology.

3/8/23 • 20:11

Marianne Talbot’s career and personal life have been characterized by versatility and excellence. Marianne, now serving as Chief Marketing and Business Development Officer at Bailey & Glasser LLP, has donned numerous hats, including that of a trial attorney, business development expert, executive coach, diversity and inclusion strategist, author, and mother. In today's turbulent talent pool, it is a rare occurrence to find someone who excels in multiple areas, but Marianne is a jack of all trades and a master of all. In today’s episode, tune in to hear David and Marianne discuss: Her unique mantra of growth through diversity, firm culture, and passionThe importance of a pivot and hustle-oriented mindsetThe GALA approach to business development Marianne was also kind enough to create a unique planning resource for our listeners, that can be accessed at the link below: https://pipelineplus.com/blog/market-leaders-podcast-episode-74-an-entrepreneurial-approach-to-firm-growth-with-marianne-talbot/#free-workbook   

3/2/23 • 22:36

Market leaders are skilled at finding opportunity in the places most people overlook. In this week's episode of the Market Leaders Podcast, Katie Munroe, Chief Marketing Officer at Zuckerman Spaeder LLP, describes how she championed an expansion of the firm's business development efforts to include partners and associates. Katie astutely recognized how bringing associates into the fold earlier on would better prepare them for future partnership responsibilities. And that in today's highly competitive legal market, it is everybody's responsibility, not just the partners, to stretch the reach of the firm. Tune in to hear Katie elaborate on: Her philosophy on how to mold BD behaviors to prepare associates for partnershipHow her team has systematized the BD processThe unique way she's brought levity to BD for associatesZuckerman Spaeder's training commitmentHow she helps associates inventory their networks and use LinkedIn more effectively

2/15/23 • 19:22

We place a lot of stock in strong beginnings: the first 100 days of a presidency, the first 10 minutes of a film, the first impression we form when meeting a new person. A strong beginning sets expectations, and solidifies our faith in someone's competence and capabilities. In this episode of the Market Leaders Podcast, Maggie Garden, Director of Business Development at Shipman & Goodwin LLP, discusses how she's positively impacted Shipman's BD culture just 3 months after stepping into her new role. Tune in to hear Maggie discuss: Some of the needs she identified when first landing at ShipmanShipman’s structured approach and use of technology to operationalize BDHow the BD team proactively breaks down silos between practice groupsThe learning services initiative and LinkedIn training she spearheaded to help close the BD skills gap among lawyersHow the firm integrates education into thought leadership with its client podcast seriesMaggie's philosophy of bringing humanity back to business

1/31/23 • 19:17